Diptrace Review
I recently acquired an LPKF PCB milling machine and have been playing some with the shareware version of Eagle CAD. Before I buy it, I'm wondering if I would be better off with DipTrace. With Eagle I need to invest about $1,500 to get beyond the 4'x3' board limitation, where DipTrace I can do any size board and they limit based on PINS. I can get 1000 pins for $350 or unlimited for $700. Eagle has been around for a long time and seems to be the standard in the hobby market, but DipTrace seems to have a better and more modern interface.
Visit the download page for DipTrace. There are 9 reviews with an average rating of 4.6. To ensure high-quality reviews and ratings, we moderate every review. DipTrace is quality Schematic Capture and PCB Design software that offers everything to create simple or complex multi-layer boards from schematic to manufacturing files.
Just wondering what others that maybe have used both think? Eagle developers need to move into the 21 Century.
Scratch that. 20th Century. Their software is the most unfriendly piece of crap I have ever used. Simple tasks like copy and paste, which Windows does for you for free, are the most tedious tasks imaginable.
For a beginner, I'd recommend something much more simple, like ExpressPCBs free software or the DesignSpark software. With something like Eagle, you would rack your brains just trying to figure out the interface on top of learning about nets, layers and routing. It's just too hard. Once they use one of the other tools, they can get the basic understanding of those basic concepts, then they can move to something more powerful like Eagle. I've honestly never used DipTrace, so I can't comment on it.
But from what I understand, it's pretty good. I like EaglePCB personally, but I use Eagle when the routing needs to be complex.
The PCB design and Schematic is ok, but coordination between the four editor programs (pcb, schematic, component, design) is lacking in some regards. Handling a large bom is a bit of trouble. They also have a few issues with the way they handle their library folders. We plan to redesign library/file connection/search system in version 2.3 (maybe will also add project file which unites all data and updates automatically). Currently each program has independent data, i.e.
When you change footpring in some library - it will not be automatically changed in schematic/pcb files where you placed it (you can update it manually though). Also all libraries/designs are separate files (you operates with them like with all other windows files). In the next release (2.2) we add net classes with multiple rules set, strict via styles to easily handle blind/buried vias, 3D preview and significantly improve manual routing + many minor improvements. Also this version will have new pattern libraries (+ all patterns have standartized names, which are similar to patterns inside component libraries).
Regards, Stanislav Ruev DipTrace Senior Developer p.s. To moderator: Captha doesn't work on password reminder (always says it is incorrect), so I have registered new account. IMO, neither Eagle nor DipTrace are appropriate software for hobbyist EDA. Both are commercial programs and are severely limited.
It will not take much of a project to exceed the limitations of either programs beginner editions and by then it will be too late. Commercial EDA software uses proprietary and.non-portable.
formats so once you start you are stuck with them forever unless you are willing to recreate your designs in another EDA tool. I have several Euroboard (160x100 mm) designs that exceed 1000 holes. Those designs are not possible with the entry editions of either Eagle or DipTrace.
The solution is to use either gEDA or KiCAD which are both Free/Open Source software. Both are excellent packages and you can use them unlimited to create whatever hobbyist project you want. Also since they are free/open source you can publish the schematics and PCB layout without fear of them being lost because of some unsupportable commercial format when the company disappears.
There have been.many. commercial EDA tools which have disappeared over the years leaving hordes of stranded orphans with no support at all. Much hobbyist project effort has been lost due to using commercial tools! The learning curve on gEDA can be steep but you can start using KiCAD with small projects relatively easily. There are tutorials available and it works well. You certainly cannot beat the price (free) and it is very capable.
The UI has improved dramatically over the last couple of years and KiCAD rivals its commercial peers in usability and quality. Seriously, from a strategic view point using F/OSS EDA tools makes a lot of sense. There is a very real risk of getting stranded or orphaned with either Eagle or DipTrace.
Yes, they look good now but either or both could disappear in an instant. Good luck with your project! Thanks and have a nice day! Andrew Lynch. Hi Andrew, There are both pluses and minuses on free open-source software. The pluses is it is free, open source and cross-platform, minuses - usually it has more bugs, is less capable and no support if compare to the software which is made and supported by full-time employees who earn money from their work.
There are very capable open-source programs though (Linux, Firefox, Open Office), but usually they also earn money, but from other sources. Regarding disappearing: Both DipTrace and Eagle have export capabilities for other EDA formats. Many programs can import Eagle files and P-CAD ASCII which can be exported from DipTrace. Commercial project may 'disappear/stop development/change policy' only if it becomes unprofitable, open-source EDA - when majority of enthusiasts who make it lose interest to work for free or their hobby was changed (there are many such examples). Major factor here is popularity, not if it is commercial or open-source. Regards, Stanislav Ruev DipTrace Team. Hi Andrew, There are both pluses and minuses on free open-source software.
The pluses is it is free, open source and cross-platform, minuses - usually it has more bugs, is less capable and no support if compare to the software which is made and supported by full-time employees who earn money from their work. There are very capable open-source programs though (Linux, Firefox, Open Office), but usually they also earn money, but from other sources.
Hi Stanislav! Yes, true Free/Open Source Software (FOSS) EDA tools generally are not the same as their commercial counterparts.
My experience with KiCAD has been very positive and it is comparable to some commercial products. It is probably not as good as DipTrace but KiCAD has an enormous advantage in that all its source code is published and free for use. Literally anyone can pull down the source code and build their own EDA tool set from scratch. That is a.permanent. advantage which outweighs any inconvenient buginess.
Bugs tend to be temporary in nature and generally go away if they are annoying enough. At least in KiCAD the developers been doing an excellent job in cleaning up the bugs and improving usability. As much as I like the KiCAD developers efforts, were they all to disappear for some reason (heaven forbid!) the KiCAD source tree would still remain published (it is GPL and mirrored) and the project could be restarted with a new group of developers. This exact scenario has played out on numerous other FOSS projects. Were DipTrace to go away, it would most likely take its source tree with it and be gone forever. That is an enormous risk that hobbyist developers are taking by using commercial EDA tools.
Regarding disappearing: Both DipTrace and Eagle have export capabilities for other EDA formats. Many programs can import Eagle files and P-CAD ASCII which can be exported from DipTrace. Commercial project may 'disappear/stop development/change policy' only if it becomes unprofitable, open-source EDA - when majority of enthusiasts who make it lose interest to work for free or their hobby was changed (there are many such examples).
Major factor here is popularity, not if it is commercial or open-source. DipTrace is a fine program and I do not doubt that at all. I have a good friend and fellow hobbyist who thinks DipTrace is the best thing since sliced bread! He likes it so much he offered to buy me the commercial version to switch the N8VEM homebrew computing project over to DipTrace. Yes, it is an excellent product and does a great job but the fear of being stranded with an unsupported and.unsupportable.
EDA tool makes the compromise of the FOSS tools more appealing. Also the FOSS EDA tools are unlimited. You can literally build PCBs with.thousands. of through holes and huge PCBs. We routinely make 50+ square inch PCBs (S-100 boards) and as big as 60 square inches.
There are no artificial limits to using KiCAD or gEDA which is very appealing. Regards, Stanislav Ruev DipTrace Team I think there is room for compromise between FOSS and commercial EDA tools like DipTrace. I would feel much more comfortable using DipTrace if it supported import/export to/from KiCAD for DipTrace schematics and PCB layouts. IMO, that would be reasonable since DipTrace commercial clients are not going to wholesale convert to KiCAD once they are comfortable using DipTrace EDA.
It also allows the 'emergency escape' in case things go wrong for DipTrace. Actually it would be beneficial to DipTrace customers since they would have insurance in case DipTrace were to disappear unexpectedly. Profit oriented commercial clients which I suspect is the bulk of your customers are not going to bother with FOSS EDA tools since speed of PCB development is top priority. Alternatively, publish an EDA schematic and PCB layout exchange format so a converter tool could be written by FOSS EDA developers.
FOSS EDA tools are not a realistic threat to commercial products like DipTrace or Eagle but could be made into a strategic advantage (no need for source escrows, etc). Commercial application suites like MS Office, etc have supported portable document import/export for years and are.stronger. for it not weaker. Please consider a bridge to KiCAD or gEDA using a portable exchange format or FOSS converter program. I think it would improve your product and make it a lot more appealing to use. Thanks and have a nice day!
Andrew Lynch. Uh, open source is good, but it has its limitations. I tried every free open source drawing program I could find, but none could reliably import/export corel/adobe formats, which the industry relies on so heavily. Besides, you can't get ahead without taking risks.:-) I don't consider the risks enormous, because diptrace imports/exports gerbers, and other high end cad software can build a schematic from gerbers. The other thing is that if your time is money, open source isn't really free.
If you have the experience and tools to modify Kicad, good, but most people looking for a cad package do not have what it takes to be modifying source code. Plus, the people that have the experience, or are developers, do not have the mindset or push ($) to build a gui to please the end user. I got hooked on Eagle several years ago. Very steep learning curve, so I wrote up how to do a few things on Instructables and I refer to these quite regularly.
Just last week I designed two new library parts that did not exist - a DC socket with round holes instead of rectangular (my PCB fab house always seem to forget the rectangular holes unless I tell them each time), and a VGA D15 socket with solder holes for more secure mounting. An Instructable helped me through that process too. I paid Eagle $125 and bought the student version. Boards 160x100 which is a Eurocard size and for that I seem to be able to do all that I need to do. (The free version is is half the size and severely limiting).
Re Kicad vs Eagle, Andrew Lynch often spends a week in the optimiser running Kicad, and with Eagle I do the same board in about 10 minutes. That means I can rip it up and rebuild it many times in an evening. I always use the autorouter as I find it is more productive to do multiple ripups/reroutes than to build the perfect board manually only to find I want to swap two chips around. I'm a hobbyist, but if I can start early in the evening when I get home I can draw a schematic, do a board layout and create the gerbers and have it emailed to the PCB house by midnight. But at the end of the day, I'm probably not qualified to comment on Eagle vs Diptrace vs Kicad, because I have only ever used one of those. I guess one really needs a comment from someone who is proficient in a number of packages.
A comprehensive and versatile PCB design application that provides you with a wide range of components and intuitive tools to aid you in your work
What's new in DipTrace Free 3.3 Beta:
- Configurable precision for all values by units, configurable grid precision.
- Improved manual routing:
- 'follow design rules' option (doesn't allow violations)
- redesigned routing modes
DipTrace Free is a powerful application that you can use to design Printed circuit boards (PCB). The application is composed out of four modules that offer you schematic capture, PCB layout, component and pattern editors. With these you can design complex, detailed schematics and even render an explorable 3D model of the board or a component.
As a CAD application, DipTrace Freedisplays a technical interface that best suites engineers but it’s built in a way that allows even novice users to fully understand how it functions. Creating a schematic is an easy task as you only need to select the components from its vast library and drag them in the workspace. The ‘Schematic’ module enables you to create a visual and logical structure with all the components connected using wires, busses, ports or by name.
With the PCB Layout module you are able to design entire boards. It provides you with drawing, route, element and placement toolbars, as well as pattern lists, hints and a layers dock. The application also offers you the use of real-time DRC, which ensures you correct mistakes before you actually make them. One of the most important features of DipTrace Free is the fact that it can quickly and easily render a 3D model of the board and have it ready for mechanical CAD modeling.
Since designing a circuit board requires a large and well organized database, the application not only provides you with thousands of components and patterns, it also grants you the possibility to design your own components.
The versatility of the application extends beyond it’s large database and intuitive tools as the tool supports Accel, P-CAD, Mentor, Allegro, PADS, Protel and Tango netlist formats.
With the above to consider and much more to discover, DipTrace Free is truly a full featured PCB design application.
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